Tuesday, October 4, 2011

Ecuminism a Heresy?

Ecuminism is a new word for me.
Means to agree, to disagree, in a polite way to work in unity towards a common cause.
Ecuminism has been a long time issue with the Christian (Orthodox) faith, because it meant accepting changes forced upon them by world religious conferences.
The story is very interesting .

I found these videos, which discuss what Ecuminism means and why it is not liked.
I think many people would benefit from listening to them, even though it consists of 15 short you tube parts to it.
So if you have the time........

I tried putting in some info as to what each part said.

part 1

They refer to questions like is there absolute truth?
How diluting truth to the point whereby people do not believe in faith anymore.
How unity in fact means diversity and compassion in fact means tolerance of difference.

If you oppose unity (ecuminism) it means you are for disunity, an Orwellian double talk.

The Churches position, is to teach certain truths, in how it is to be a Christian.
So it can't believe in difference.

The church is Christ and Christ is unity.

part 2

part 3

Orthodoxy believes God chooses man.
Man understands and believes because he is chosen
and enlightened and not coerced into believing by Theologians.

Truth doesn't change the church or the body of Christ.

Why Calvinism is wrong.
We can't prove or disprove God exists and God does not want us to.
Two issues here :

a) one teaches there is a little bit of truth and little bit of falsity everywhere and the church is already here but we have not recognized it

b) there is a little bit of truth and a little bit of falsity but the church itself, has not been established, which is contradictory with the idea of the Apostles beginning it.

We will never agree as to what is the absolute truth.

The Ecuminist movement began in the last century, in the Protestant churches because
Social corruption divided churches, into smaller and smaller bits.

Ecuminist ideology, Deals with enlightenment and that every person can arrive at his own personal belief .
The belief is run on Pride and Ego and the inability to accept that you might be wrong.
There is an inability to accept that
there is an alternative as Russia found out does exist because of consisting of different cultural groups Russia managed to pull it together under Orthodoxy until now, when western influences entered, saying they know the only Right.


Who is the person of Christ?

His person unified the world.
His body is the church and his church should be unified.

Chaos implies a sick society.

Christ created Apostles who ordained priests and deacons and the orthodox church continued the continuity unchanged from them.

There are always differences but not about the basics.

Orthodox church consists of many races and cultures. Greek Italian French Armenian, etc.... Man is an individual with freedoms.

Orthodox believers never imposed the faith. It was always a natural order.
Go live your life, people see it's loving and free and are attracted to it, to live a life of love.

The Roman Churches' problem consisted with not accepting the freedom of the individual or group and it only speaks Latin.

Splits also exist with the Jewish and Islam faiths because they do not come naturally.

In Catholic and Anglican religions, Lenton rules. People get penalized for not obeying.

In Orthodoxy fasting is a tool . The idea being, the more you work your garden, the more yield you will obtain.
Christ carried his own cross symbolizing that the strong should help the weak.
So nothing is enforced or punished.

Orthodoxy is not about saying we have a 2000 yr tradition filled with diversity, come join us.

The Orthodox religion begins with saying. We are sorry.

The problem with that is it's not going to examine the real bones of contention theologically.

This is not a genuine unity (ecominism) and some orthodox churches are not in communion with other Orthodox churches because you have to believe in your product, in this case following the main road from the point of origin (of the apostles).

The Calender for example, was changed to the world Gregorian calender. and many people still operate under the Julian calender.

The Pope in 1852 decided to remove a few days of the calender because the Winter and summer solstices shifted, according to an astronomer.
This calender change was imposed by the Roman Catholic Church and it was also imposed on the Orthodox churches creating a schism.

Changes in Greece also created Schisms by introducing indoctrination of priests through schools.

The leaders of the ecuminist movement introduced the abolition of fasts, shaving of beards, civilian clothes for the clergy etc...
They created major changes to the church, making it closer to Protestantism.

The Orthodox faith argues that
You don't put man before God, if God is God.

The foreign ideas did introduce enlightenment but the job of the Orthodox faith, is to teach faith through learning what the limits are. They feel it's important to have self discipline.
So it is seen, that Ecumunists teach disunity and divergence not tolerance and unity.

Ecuminism removes a person from the lifestyle of the church, whose job is to educate the soul and instead, educates the mind and teaches mistaken ideas.

You can't teach orthodox theology, separated from the life of the church life.

Orthodox theology was learned within the context of the full life of the family and community.

You can't bring God down to man. Man must go to God.

With Ecuminism you destroy the Church with mans' principles. It becomes a social club and removed from the active life, where the prime concern was the acquisition of the human spirit.

The Church then, is no longer a transformation club but a social club,
and the family becomes dysfunctional, which America has now become.
A land of divorce.
A land full of arrogance, elitism ,smugness, self satisfaction.

Orthodoxy promotes humbleness, forgiveness, love and always promotes self examination in how to improve oneself, one's faults.
The Saying goes : Keep your mind in hell so you remember how wonderful God is
but do not despair.
This way of thinking forces one to take responsibility for oneself.
Ecuminism doesn't improve family, doesn't heal, but for the sake of getting along , says we shall come together and talk about the weather instead of the true things which will heal and unite. lol

So you are tolerant but really intolerant, so this is hypocracy, and empty formula.

You either admit you are wrong or someone else is and that's not nice, not politically correct. lol
So with Ecuminism promoting No discipline the result produces rebellious children and that's not a way of producing a living church.

The path to true enlightenment is broken and is not true salvation and does not improve mankind.

Ecuminism created schisms like the
Movement away from Christianity into Roman Catholicism.

Ecuminism means, a created world, the man made organization of the created world.

Orthodoxy is not a religion.

It's a therapeutic system, the means by which the soul is cleansed, where we ensue communion, to again envision God.
To do this, it has to be agreed as to who Christ was.

Ecuministic, Humanistic, presuposition of humans on their own, without the holy spirit, says either the church hasn't existed cause there has not been unity or the church will exist or it's a superficial entity where it can encompass all kind of doctrine contradictions.

Everything is reduced to human opinion, a piece of the truth, which contradicts who Christ was who came to reveal the full truth.

Draw a circle showing the boundaries of who God is.
To understand everything inside the circle, is to understand God.
This is the problem. They believed the human mind could understand everything in the circle about God. but how much you understand about God has to do with how close you come to the center of the circle where God is.

Stepping outside the circle boundary into diversity, which is what Ecuminism is doing, results in confusion and then they come to the conclusion that they will agree to disagree because they do not understand who Christ is and who God is.
So every one has little truths outside the circle
and real truth be damned.
Anglicans today especially have problems in their faith because of ecuminism.

Churches cannot be a part of the mainstream and be true to themselves.

So the calendar changes from Julian to Gregorian caused a lot of turmoil because people lost days and didn't even know when their birthday was, for one thing.

The Russian church is still under the old calender as opposed to Ecuminism which creates chaos, disorder and schism.

Unity for the church deals with spiritual, liturgical, doctrinal and true unity.
Truth, was violated to keep up with the west under ecuminism.
This is what happens when people step out of the circle.
The church is left with teaching half truths with ecunimism
Ecuminism = infection = disease.

In the 20th C
fasts, changes in liturgy, etc occurred to bring the Greek church closer to the west,
on the basis of humanism.
ex : pedophilias are being dealt with as a psychological disorder, instead of a spiritual problem
as it was before.
Orthodox churches try to make statements in conferences dealing with the Ecuminical movement in world counsel of churches.
Father George Florovsky said unity was never lost.
It is still found in the orthodox church in the original faith.
but He himself floundered between ecuminism and the original Orthodox faith.

Orthodox churches does not say all Christians have to become Orthodox.
When you get to the point of atheism, where do you draw the line with Ecuminism?

The Thiatera Confession - recognizes the priesthoods and church branches of the one church.

Muslims deny the divinity of Christ but not the one God.

Orthodoxy does not say if you are outside the church circle you are lost in darkness.

This is left to the mercy of God.
But if you stay within the circle and pray with close friends of God, in the center of that circle, is God himself and we will be closer to him.

Inner enlightenment is attaining the image of Christ in your heart and soul. By means of his truth , you begin to understand the doctrines and why they are the way they are and why Christ said what he said.
It's not a mystery because you see more and more of that circle.

and as a result a light comes on and you begin to live according to it and given salvation,
theosis and divinization.

Christ never operated through force and threats. He operated through voluntary free will.
Orthodox church never said there was a special way to approach Christ.

However, you can't erase the hard drive of the church if you are to understand who God truly is.

Agreement to disagree promotes decay, violence, promotes the lowest aspects of man. enhances depravity, and promotes humanity going astray.

You need morality, self discipline, etc...
You need to see where the church is, use it as an anchor to focus on, within the boundaries of the circle.

Well I enjoyed listening to this program.
Learning about Ecuminism is something we should all know and understand I think, because it applies to what's happening in todays' world.
I also found it interesting that unlike Islam and Judaism, Orthodoxy is not a religion. It's just a way of life.

Little bits of truths from a big picture.

Have a great day!!


George said...

I found this series on Ecuminism to be very interesting. Thank you.

A Lady's Life said...

George - I found this very interesting because you don't see this happening.
It all looks good from the outset but unity does not mean united and destroys from the inside out.It chips away till nothing is left and then man is the poorer for it because he is bereft of education.
Education does not equal instruction.